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I just found out about this - and I am mad!

L losingsleepMember
I have read all of your justifications, but I am really p-o'd at the fact that "sniping" has apparently become the norm now. This basically reduces auction bidding to a contest between whomever has the best software and conection. From now on, I will be emailing the sellers in advance and attempt my purchases that way, since ebay is no longer the 'regular person's' shopping tool. This is just ridiculous.
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C chatterMember
quote:
Originally posted by losingsleep:

This basically reduces auction bidding to a contest between whomever has the best software and conection. From now on, I will be emailing the sellers in advance and attempt my purchases that way, since ebay is no longer the 'regular person's' shopping tool. This is just ridiculous.



Actually it is a contest that goes to the highest bidder. All the sniping software in the world won't help you if you are not the highest bidder.

You will be e-mailing sellers "in advance" of what? The auction? How will you know when a seller will be auctioning an item, until the auction is actually underway? At that point it is an eBay violation for the seller to cancel the auction and deal off eBay; it is probably a violation for a buyer to solicit this, as well.

When you join the ranks of snipers (as you surely will, or else you would not be in this forum in the first place), you will happily understand that sniping is simply a bidding strategy--nothing more, nothing less. And you will indeed use it successfully, whether manually or via software. Wink
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J jabbergahMember
So who left the door open and let all these cry-baby anti-snipers in?!? Frown

If you don't like the way the on-line Ebay auctions work with early deep pocket bidders and/or last minute bidders, why don't you just go down to your local Wally World to make all your purchases? Confused You don't HAVE to participate in online auctions if you find you can't handle it! Or you COULD just participate in auction listings with the BUY IT NOW option and click on that option. That way you DEFEAT the evil snipers! -- Ha! Ha! Or you could frequent the auction sites that automatically EXTEND auctions whenever there is a bid within the last 10 minutes of the auction -- no snipers there!

Jabbergah                                                    
puppyraiserpuppyraiserMember
losingsleep:

If you used AS, you wouldn't be loosing all that sleep ! Smile

If you would follow eBays advice and bid your MAXIMUM, you wouldn't loose auctions to snipers as often. When you did loose, you would be OK with the fact you didn't pay more than the item was worth to you.

Till now, you've been bidding for a bargan, with a hope to win. Snipers bid for a win, and hope for a bargan.

         

Instead of typing all the other arguments, the above link pretty much covers any objection you may have about a service like this.

....oh, and WELCOME to the forum.

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J jabbergahMember
....so I'm not done stomping on you! Razz

Losing (appropriate abbrev., I think! Razz), just WHO ARE YOU to insist a seller SHOULD accept a bid that's LESS than maximum bid some one is willing to pay?!? As Chatter said, the LAST bid is not necessarily the one that wins. As in ALL auctions, live or on-line, it is the HIGHEST bid that wins!! And it doesn't matter WHEN that highest bid is placed -- at the beginning of the auction, in the middle, or near the end -- the highest bidder WINS! That's how auctions work!
If you don't like the way auctions work, go buy your stuff at a retail store!

Hey! Here is an idea guaranteed to increase your winning percentage up to 100%!! From now on, bid 1000 times the value of any item you bid on. There isn't even any pressure of waiting until the end of the auction or nothing. Place your bid at the very BEGINNING if you like! No losing sleep anymore. It should be fun for you to watch any and all snipers swoop in at the last minute and leave empty-handed because you have such a high proxy bid! At least this way, the seller may get a decent return on the item he lists.

Just remember, if you are considering an item worth about $25.00, just bid $25,000 on it. The way ebay handles your bid (via proxy), you will probably NEVER need to pay $25,000. You will only need to pay one bid increment higher than the 2nd highest bidder! And if that 2nd highest bidder bids in the last 15 seconds of the auction (a sniper!), your win will be even sweeter for you! Now isn't that a great deal?! You will never again need to deal with the heartache of losing an auction again!

Or you could continue placing low-ball bids on items, hoping to steal an item from a seller for less than it's value, bearly above the eBay listing expenses, then come WHINING when somebody ELSE is willing to PAY MORE THAN YOU for an item!

"NO MORE SNIPES FOR YOU!!!" -- Snipe Nazi

Jabbergah                                                    
J jabbergahMember
...So why do I always have to be the Bad guy! Roll Eyes

Good idea to post that link, Puppy. It is very good and a worthwhile read. Wonder if Losing will read it? Sounds as if "mind is already made up, don't confuse me with the facts!" Confused

I'm thinking of changing my ID to Snipe Nazi, then I can be nasty ALL the time! Razz Wink

Jabbergah                                                    
bartelbybartelbyMember
I would like Losing to answer me a question.....

When is a snipe a snipe?

Do you class a snipe as someone who bids in the last 5 minutes? last 2 minutes? last minute? last 30 seconds?

Ok, a few questions....

Have you ever sat at your puter and waited for an auction to get near the close and tried to put in a last minute bid? whether you planned to do it or panicked and upped your proxy....you sniped buster!!!

What about the person that comes online and sees the item of their dreams ends in 2 minutes, they place a manual bid and with their crap connection and ebay is quite busy, it lands in the last 15 seconds....are they in your bad books??

I mean come on - just because the rest of us have found a wonderful efficent tool that means we can have lives instead of sitting and watching ebay alllll day....doesnt make us bad people - it makes us smart people.
As Puppy often says, Auction Sniper isnt magic, you wont win automatically. You still need to beat allllll those other bidders that are sitting at their computers. Auction Sniper plays by ebay rules (which is why it is allowed), you need the Maximum bid to win or adios!!

In closing of my Jabber like essay.....

Join the Smart people!!!

Lexie
L losingsleepMember
Sorry - I've already read all the stuff there is out there. The fact is (and you guys know it!) the whole point of an auction, for the bidders, is to get the item at the LOWEST price. If you use the proxy bidding and bid your maximum at the beginning of the auction, people WILL bid more, and you often will change your mind and up your bid because of that. That's the whole reason this type of software has been created. To circumvent having a high bid *known* about, and to keep the bids lower. Don't hand me that crap about what's fair for the seller. You don't give a rat's patooty about that. I stand by my earlier post - I think it stinks - for the buyers AND the sellers.
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puppyraiserpuppyraiserMember
quote:
losingsleep:
Sorry - I've already read all the stuff there is out there. The fact is (and you guys know it!) the whole point of an auction, for the bidders, is to get the item at the LOWEST price. If you use the proxy bidding and bid your maximum at the beginning of the auction, people WILL bid more, and you often will change your mind and up your bid because of that. That's the whole reason this type of software has been created. To circumvent having a high bid *known* about, and to keep the bids lower.

I think you're starting to catch on !

L losingsleepMember
"I think you're starting to catch on !"

Duh. Starting? I understand exactly what it is. It's a cheat. Professional (and somewaht less than ethical) ebayers have found a way to tilt the playing field in their favor. What a joke that you pretend to wish others to join. At some point, when most bidders are using bidding software, then the actions cease to exist as we know them. At some point, they will become disallowed. Kinda like Napster. Remember that? Wink
puppyraiserpuppyraiserMember
Bottom line, If you are willing to enter a bid higher than mine you will win the auction. If you enter your MAXIMUM bid, and are in the lead, I have no idea how high your proxy bid is.

Snipers get only one shot at winning an auction. We realize this and enter our REAL maximum bid. Not our starting max, or medium max.

Looks like you didn't care to click on the link I gave you above.

J jabbergahMember
Losing posted:
quote:

Sorry - I've already read all the stuff there is out there.


So you read Puppy's link?

quote:

...the whole point of an auction, for the bidders, is to get the item at the LOWEST price.


Oh? And what's the point for the seller?

quote:

If you use the proxy bidding and bid your maximum at the beginning of the auction, people WILL bid more, and you often will change your mind and up your bid because of that.


Can be true, but not necessarily. I've seen auctions with multiple bidders that were won by the FIRST bid placed in the auction. We all were dying to know what the guy bid!

Also, if you took up my challenge to bid $25,000 on something worth $25, and you place that bid at the beginning of an auction, do you REALLY think someone out there will come along and bid more?!? If you really believe that, prove it!

quote:

Don't hand me that crap about what's fair for the seller. You don't give a rat's patooty about that.


Oops! Your ignorance is showing! Most of the folks on this forum, like me, are buyers AND sellers. Why would I not care about getting a fair shake as a seller? If the sellers aren't getting acceptable prices for the items they list, guess what! -- soon there won't be anything listed on ebay on which to bid! I sure would stop listing stuff!

quote:

I stand by my earlier post - I think it stinks - for the buyers AND the sellers.


So why exactly does it stink for the winning bidder? I would guess they're pretty happy! Smile So why exactly does it stink for a seller to receive a higher price for his listed item?!? Confused So actually, it ONLY STINKS FOR THE LOSERS!!!

If you don't like football, don't go to the football stadium; if you don't like opera, don't go to the opera house; and if you don't like sniping, what in the world are you doing in a snipers' forum?!?! Confused

"NO SNIPES FOR YOU!!!" - Snipe Nazi Razz

Jabbergah                                                    
J jabbergahMember
Losing posts:
quote:
It's a cheat. Professional (and somewaht less than ethical) ebayers....

OOOOHHHH PLEASE PLEASE!!! Explain exactly how bidding in the last 5-10 minutes of an auction is cheating or unethical?? Confused

Losing posts:
quote:
At some point, they will become disallowed. Kinda like Napster. Remember that?

SOORRRY!!! Bad analogy!! Napster was circumventing long established protective copyright laws for creative products (music & songs). Please explain exactly what laws are broken when someone bids in the last 5 - 10 minutes of an online auction??? Razz

Losing posts:
quote:
What a joke that you pretend to wish others to join.

You're RIGHT!!! It WAS a joke!! Give back your free snipes and go away!!! Razz Puppy, take back your welcome! Wink

Jabbergah                                                    
J jabbergahMember
& sour! Guess which I am?! Wink

Puppy posts:
quote:
No, the best thing to give someone that is really angry is... Smile have a nice day.


OK, Losing, have a nice day......somewhere else!!!! Razz

Actually, I'm changing my mind. It's been a lot of fun beating up on you! Razz Knowing there are ebayers out there like you makes sniping so much more FUN!!!! Razz

"NO SNIPES FOR YOU!!!" - Snipe Nazi

Jabbergah                                                    
J jabbergahMember
Subject line doesn't refer to anything -- it just looks funny in the subject listing! Big Grin

This LINK (ClikHere) describes the advantages & disadvantages of the 3 bidding strategies. Strategy#1 is lowball/incremental bidding, strategy#2 is proxy bidding, and strategy#3 is "sniping".

Losing, you obviously DON'T use strategy#3! So which bid stategy DO you use?

How long have you been an ebayer? How many feedbacks do you have? What is the item# of the auction that you lost to set you off to come in this forum and call a bunch of strangers "cheats" and "unethical"?

Just curious about your background.

Jabbergah                                                    
bartelbybartelbyMember
quote:
At some point, they will become disallowed. Kinda like Napster. Remember that?


Umm Hello!! Ebay has realised there is more money to be earned by software like this and I am sure you will see them doing it quite soon. DUH!! Ebay wont disallow it as it gives them MORE fees etc.

I agree with Puppy - go play with the other sooks in the Ebay forums. We have given you our views and your sour grapes arent letting your mind comprehend what we are saying.

That said....

Please have a nice day there Smile

Lexie
L losingsleepMember
Get a life folks. Yes I read the links - I had already found that info before your post - I TOLD you I have done the research. I completely understand. I really do. I have nothing against someone faithfully sitting at their computer until the end of the auction. It IS an auction after all. The software is the cheat - and you know it. Otherwise you would not be here. I simply not a person that likes to cheat, that's all.

Now you have a nice day too.
C chatterMember
quote:
Originally posted by losingsleep:
Get a life folks. Yes I read the links - I had already found that info before your post - I TOLD you I have done the research. I completely understand. I really do. I have nothing against someone faithfully sitting at their computer until the end of the auction. It IS an auction after all. The software is the cheat - and you know it. Otherwise you would not be here. I simply not a person that likes to cheat, that's all.

Now you have a nice day too.


How is the software a method of cheating? You have contradicted yourself because you complain in the first post of this thread about snipers, only to say now that there is no problem with sniping; it is the software used.

All the software does is place the bid. Many people bid manually; we simply use a software (available to anyone and everyone) program to place the bid automatically for us, so we don't have to be sitting at the computer "until the end of the auction." because, contrary to your snide remark, we DO have lives. What is the problem with that? Confused
J jabbergahMember
Actually, I was afraid you'd go away -- it's really been fun jousting with you! You never did say what auction you lost that got you so riled up in the first place!?

In your last post, you seem to have cooled off a little from before. I can tell because your argument has gone from irrationally emotional to just plain silly! Razz

Losing posts:
quote:
...I have nothing against someone faithfully sitting at their computer until the end of the auction. It IS an auction after all. The software is the cheat...

HUH?!?!?!? Confused
Something that's OK to do in person, but not by "power of attorney"? That's basically what it is. Users of AS or other similar software are granting them/asking them (the software service) to place a bid in their (the bidders') behalf.

If software is a cheat, as you claim, then everybody should stop using Word Processing software and pull out the old IBM Selectrics & Wite-Out!?! Eek If software is a cheat, then forget electronic database software -- get out the index cards and rolodexes! Roll Eyes If software is a cheat, forget the kids doing any research on the internet or searches on data CDs. OH NO, we gotta make them kiddies wade thru moldey smelling heavy encyclopedia books like the youth of old did to find the facts they need! (Do schools even HAVE encyclopedias anymore?!?)

Bottom line is, if you're OK with the strategy of snipe bidding, it is ridiculous to say to find a way to do it more reliably, conveniently, and efficiently is cheating!?! It's SMART is what it is! Big Grin

You'll need to do better than THAT to rattle our cages again! Wink

Jabbergah                                                    
J jabbergahMember
Falcon,

You might be right on. It's been an interesting exercise to converse, though. I dunno, in the last post, Losing is still spouting the same old irrational arguments, but with just a little less conviction, I think??

Whatever, Losing hasn't changed my mind about using whatever valid tool or strategy to improve my winning chances on eBay! Wink

Jabbergah                                                    
T theothersteveMember
Let me through some more fuel on the fire -

In my experience, snipers are not only more savy about how to bid, but also about what an item is worth.

After all, if you don't know what an item is worth then you're reduced to letting the other bidders set the value of the item. If you do know what an item is worth (this could be only what it's worth to you), then you have no problem sniping. The arguement to this would be, then why don't you just place a proxy bid for what it is worth and let it go.

The problem with this is that I've just shared my knowledge with everyone. It's taken me a long time to gather the info I have on the things I collect. Why shouldn't I use that info for only my benefit? Why should I give that away?

The other reason that snipers are more savy, is that they take the emotion out of it. Auctions are built on the emotion, that it's only $1 more - what's the big deal. Sniping takes this away, which IS bad for sellers.

tos
puppyraiserpuppyraiserMember
quote:
losingsleep:
I have nothing against someone faithfully sitting at their computer until the end of the auction.

Now it is OK as long as you do it manually???? We can't do that ! We have a life !

You can say what you will as often as you please, but that doesn't make it true.

eBay is not going to change their rules just for you. The people here on the forum are not going to change how and what they bid. Doesn't look like you're going to change either.

You came to this forum looking for a fight. I won't repeat the same thing over and over to someone that doesn't want to hear, so....



[This message was edited by Puppy Raiser on January 08, 2004 at 11:34 AM.]
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S shirleyMember
To take Jabber's colorful arguement one step further, if the AS software is a cheat, isn't the proxy bidding system a cheat as well? Same concept -- you're using a software tool to place and raise your bid for you so that you don't have to "faithfully sit at your computer until the end of the auction" bidding yourself, one increment at a time... Perhaps LosingSleep would prefer THAT method?
J jabbergahMember
Lexie posted:
quote:
Wouldnt it be funny if we had actually swayed him/her (although I am leaning towards him) and they signed up but dont want to admit that they did coz of stubborn pride (another HIM factor).


Hey! Hey! Hey!?! The arguments are too illogical to be a guy! It's GOTTA be a GAL! Razz

Hey, LosingSleep! Here is an e-book for you! It is "Buying and Selling on eBay". >> Click Here << It is edited by Rick & written by,...um..., my favorite author! You've probably not read THIS book since it was made available just before Christmas. Lots of good stuff in it!

Now we were wondering, LosingSleep -- are you M or F?

And how old are you & what are you wearing? Eek Whoa!! Wait a minute! Wrong forum for THAT! My bad! Roll Eyes
Wink

Jabbergah                                                    
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