AS versus Ebay Proxy bidding

Hey dude,
question 1: yes, you'll lose in that case
question 2: no, there you will not lose to that bidder.

To try to explain briefly.... What does AS do for you? AS places your maximum bid EXACTLY as if you were placing your maximum bid, period, end of story, fini. AS places it one and only one time, exactly as if you logged on to ebay yourself and placed that one maximum bid. AS doesn't, like, test the waters, it does NOT place a series of bids for you, each successive one based on how the current (visible) price of the item moves. All AS does is fire the one single bullet of your maximum bid, and that's that. Finito.

Whatever then happens at that point is a function of ebay's proxy bidding system and the other guys' maximum bid. You may not be too familiar with this system--suggest you read ebay's "help" section on that, but for a lot people it becomes clear enough after a few bids on ebay. Anyway, proxy bidding means that ebay shows you meeting (up to your maximum bid) any upping of the ante by any other bidder; it keeps raising your DISCLOSED bid to match (and slightly top) any subsequent bids (in their maximum bid amounts), up to the maximum you specified in your own original bid.

So right now some guy Bob has a $21 bid showing. Yes, probably his max bid is actually higher than $21. Say his max bid is $50. Then another bidder bids (in maximum bid amounts) $25, then $30, then finally $49; immediately in lockstep, the current price moves to $26 (Bob), then $31 (Bob) then finally $50 (Bob). If YOU bid $75, or set your AS snipe at $75 (and no other bids intervene), the price goes to $51, with you leading, and Bob in second place with his max bid of $50. Again, what AS does here is simply place the single maximum bid for you of $75; it was eBay that moved the current price to $51, i.e. just enuf for you to top Bob.

If Bob's max bid is $80, instead of $50, then at the moment that you, or AS, place your maximum $75 bid, the current price goes to $76, with Bob in first place, you in second. (Course this is always assuming that there will be no other bidders--but obviously you can't count on that, and who knows there may be 10 other guys who have already set AS snipes on it for more than $75.

To try to clarify further, EVERY bidder who places a max bids for more than the current minimum bid amount is a "proxy bidder". But all this means ebay will automatically up the bidder's visible bid until either (A) it maxes out, reaches his maximum bid or (B) it just barely tops any other bidder's maximum bid. If it's only your $75 against the other guy's $50, you win and the final price will be $51.

Also suggest try doing a "Find" search (in the tool bar right above the text of your first post on the page) for the terms "proxy bidding" in this forum. You'll find 100s of posts that could help clarify. Yup, your question has been kind of raised often.

By the way, I don't see how the difference between the two current bidders could be $1. (That is, unless there is a $21 reserve price, but put that aside.) The minimum bid increment (at least in the U.S.) is only $0.50, up through a current price of $24.99, and it is $1 only once the price passes $25. So the difference should be at most $0.50.

Chatter's Bidding Primer (revised, 2006):

A snipe is a last minute bid, generally placed in the last minute or closing seconds of an auction. This can be done manually, with you sitting in front of your computer, bidding at the last second, or it can be done via software, such as Auction Sniper. The point is to get a high bid in, giving others little time to respond with a counterbid.

If someone bids higher earlier in the auction, that person will win, because he bid the highest. That is how auctions work. The point here is that you have no way of knowing what his high bid (proxy bid) really is; you only know that he bid at least enough to be on top. For example, if bidder A bids $42 and bidder B bids $75, while the auction is still going on, you will see bidder B listed as the high bidder at $43, which is one bid increment over the next-highest bid of $42. You know that B bid more than A, but you do not know how much. If the auction ends like that, B will win for the same $43 price and you will never know what his max really was.

Let us say that bidder C comes along and bids $61. Bidder B will still win, but he will be listed as winning for $62, since much more of his proxy bid was used up to keep him as top bidder, by placing him one increment (in this case, a dollar) above the second-highest bidder, C.

Why snipe? Because many people do not bid their max. Trying to get a good price, they tend to bid just enough to stay the high bidder. They do not bid what they are REALLY willing to pay until someone else comes along and outbids them. Then they tend to bid higher. Sometimes this cycle goes back and forth, with two or more bidders (called "nibblers") continually outbidding each other, in an expensive game of one up-manship. But these same nibblers tend to leave their bids alone if no one else outbids them.

That is where snipers come in. Bidder X may have bid $25 on an item, but will go higher if someone outbids him. He may go up to $100 if he feels he has to, in order to win, but leaves his bid at $25, thinking he is getting a better deal. He overlooks the fact that if he bids the $100, he will not pay that amount, unless other bidders push the auction price up that high. So along comes bidder Y, a sniper, who bids $50 in the last seconds and wins for $26! There is no time for bidder X to come back and raise his bid. He is upset, because he knows that he would have been willing to go higher. Additionally, he does not know that bidder Y's max was $50--all he sees is that he lost the auction for a dollar.

Does sniping work every time? No. There is no magical was to guarantee a win. But eBay is replete with bidders who nibble and do not observe or analyze their own bidding behaviors, and that is why we snipers tend to win. Many of these are new eBayers, though you would be shocked at how many veterans act the same way. Consequently, we have a very high success rate--mine approaches 97%, with all of my losses going to higher bidders who were willing to pay more than I was.

The key is to decide the ABSOLUTE max you will pay, set your snipe through AS, and leave it at that. They will take care of the rest. Do not obsess about getting the very last bid in--at three seconds, instead of eight--just decide what the "I will pay this and not a penny more" amount is and stay with it. It is more important that your bid get in at the end, than it is to risk your bid not reaching eBay in time. (If someone else bids that late in the auction--less than fifteen seconds remaining--he is another sniper and was probably going to bid at that point, regardless of whether or not you had bid, so do not get unnerved by that.) This is why it is important to bid your absolute maximum. Most of the time you will find that your max does not get reached and you will get your win at a good price. When you do lose, it will not be because you did not bid your max; you will simply have been outbid—whether by another sniper or by someone who bid much earlier in the auction—but you will know that someone else was willing to pay more.

Most of us tend to use a 5-10 lead time; some members add a few seconds on Sunday evenings (eBay's busiest time) and on any day when an auction ends exactly on a quarter hour (X:00, X:15, X:30, X:45), as these are also very busy, due to sellers' incentive listings. We also bid unusual amounts, such as $23.83, as occasionally we end up winning auctions where others bid even dollar amounts or just one cent over the dollar.

Good luck to all!