Are multiple snipes okay?

Sure you can set up more than 1 snipe on the same item, but why bother? It's not the last bid the wins, it's the the highest bid. It doesn't matter if another sniper gets in a bid 1 second before the end of the auction if your 8 second bid is higher.

Your best chance to win an auction is to set the maximum amount you're willing to pay. Then, if you don't win, it's only because someone was willing to pay more, not because their bid was placed before or after yours.

I know that burning, excited feeling you can get when you find something you really, really want. I also know the disappointment when you lose that item. But rest assured -- eventually, another one always shows up on eBay.

Good luck!

[This message was edited by star_trkr on April 09, 2003 at 09:09 AM.]

Star trkr,

Thanks for the response.
I'm new to this, so here's another question...

Say the item is currenly 10 dollars.
I set my max snipe bid to $200.
If 1 minute prior to closing, it is still $10, and someone put $20 as their bid 15 seconds before closing, will my Snipe at 5 seconds before closing put down $22(something higher than $20) or $200?

Thanks,
Jim

Sniper Jim, you're confusing what Auction Sniper does and what eBay's proxy bid system does. First, AS places your maximum bid with eBay at the time you set. Once eBay records the bid it is just as though you had personally placed it: enough will be used to establish your bid as the high bid by one bid increment -- fifty cents in your example. The remainder of your bid will become a "proxy" amount, sort of on standby to offset any later bids that come along, up to the maximum bid you placed originally. In your example, then, the previous high bid was $20 and your bid was $200. EBay will show your bid as $20.50 and that's all you're liable for paying unless somebody comes along and bids at least $21, at which point eBay will use some or all of your hidden proxy amount of $179.50 to top that.

Does that help?

Of course, be aware of reserve auctions. Your snipe could go much higher than the next increment if you're the first to reach the reserve price. This also is a function of ebay and not AS.

Thanks, Rick. I forgot that. In the case of a reserve bid auction, eBay shows your bid as the reserve amount if and when you meet the reserve. That could be, and often is, significantly more than just one bid increment. In non-reserve auctions only enough of your bid to top the previous high bidder by one bid increment is shown.

Steve,

Thanks for the reply.
So, let me get this straight then...
Correct me if I am wrong...

No matter what the current price is 5 seconds before closing, if my max as bid is higher than the current bid price, then ebay will take the next increment up? Like if it was $20 before closing, I enter bid $30, or AP does it for me, then will the final purchase price be $30? Or $20.50?

Thanks,
Jimmy

Actually, here is another confusion that I have, pls help me out if anyone can shed some light.

Say item is $10 as of current.
My opponent is using a sniper program.
I am too.
My opponent set max bid to $100.
I set max bid to $110.
My opponent set lead time for 4 seconds.
I set lead time for 6 seconds.

Someone said earlier doesn't matter what time you set it at, it's the max bid that makes difference.

But, seems to me that it will play out this way... that at 6 seconds before closing, my bid would go in as $10.50. At 4 seconds, my opponent would go in as $11.00. He still wins even though his max bid was less than mine...?!? What's going on? I must be missing something.

Help! Thanks!

Jim

quote:

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Originally posted by SniperJim:
Actually, here is another confusion that I have, pls help me out if anyone can shed some light.

Say item is $10 as of current.
My opponent is using a sniper program.
I am too.
My opponent set max bid to $100.
I set max bid to $110.
My opponent set lead time for 4 seconds.
I set lead time for 6 seconds.

Someone said earlier doesn't matter what time you set it at, it's the max bid that makes difference.

But, seems to me that it will play out this way... that at 6 seconds before closing, my bid would go in as $10.50. At 4 seconds, my opponent would go in as $11.00. He still wins even though his max bid was less than mine...?!? What's going on? I must be missing something.

Help! Thanks!

Jim

---

Jim, in the scenario you quoted, you would win the auction for $102.50. When you bid, eBay does record (in one shot) the full amount you bid, but it only SHOWS the amount necessary to win. So in your scenario, eBay received your $110 bid with :06 remaining, but showed the high bid only as $10.50, as you stated, because that was all that was necessary at that point. But the other sniper's bid of $100 at :04 would raise the high bid (YOUR high bid) to $102.50, since his high bid of $100 caused most of your proxy to be used up to that level. It does not matter whose bid came in at :06 and whose came in at :04. It matters that yours was higher by $10 and you would win the auction by one bid increment ($2.50 at this level). No one would be reacting to either snipe, anyway, so neither of you would likely see anything except the final winning bid.

Understand eBay's proxy bidding system.

The other sniper does NOT know how much your bid is. If you place a high bid, even one with five seconds remaining, your true max is not automatically revealed, only the amount necessary to make you the high bidder. For example, if the item is currently going for $26.50, and your snipe is for $35, your last-minute bid would simply raise the price to $27.50, not $35. If someone else puts in another last-minute bid for $30, then you would still win, but for $31. But if that other sniper placed a bid for $50, then there is no way you can win, since his snipe would raise the winning bid to $36, one increment above your snipe. That sniper had no way of knowing that you bid $35; he simply placed a snipe for a higher amount, and would have done so, regardless of whether or not you bid. The only difference would be in the precise amount paid by the winning sniper.

So, most of the time these are other snipers who were simply willing to pay more than you did. But people who do not understand how proxy bidding works see their own $35 snipe and the winning $36 bid and mistakenly conclude that the other member was responding to the AS snipe, outbidding it by a mere dollar. This misunderstanding is widespread on eBay, as well.

This all points back to the same thing. Decide your max well in advance, then bid that at the very last second, through AS. If you win, great--and you will win most of the time, unless you are bidding pittances. But when you do lose, it is usually because someone else was willing to pay more than you were.

Chatter,

Thanks! I understand more now.

Follow up question...

So everyone puts in their highest bid, and
proxy bid just takes the highest bidder so far
and increments the current highest bid price.

Say item is $22.50. Does that mean if I put in
$1000 and noone goes above $1000 that I will get
the item for $22.50? If so, then that is the
purpose of AS bidding seconds before the auction
ends? Just to keep the price from going up?

Thanks,
Jimmy

No, Jim. It means that so long as somebody didn't bid one increment over $1,000 ($1,025 to be exact) you'd be the winner, but at whatever price the other bidder(s) ran you up to, not $22.50. Say that the final bid from your opposition was $900. You'd win, but you'd have to pay $910. That's why it's not advisable to put a max amount in that you really wouldn't want to have to pay -- somebody might just chase you all the way up there.

You're on target with your guess about the reason for sniping. It's NOT to get the last bid in; it's to avoid the nickel-and-dime-run-the-bid-up crap you see so many less sophisticated bidders engage in.

Steve said:

>>No, Jim. It means that so long as somebody didn't bid one increment over $1,000 ($1,025 to be exact) you'd be the winner, but at whatever price the other bidder(s) ran you up to, not $22.50. Say that the final bid from your opposition was $900. You'd win, but you'd have to pay $910. That's why it's not advisable to put a max amount in that you really wouldn't want to have to pay -- somebody might just chase you all the way up there.<<

Exactly. You will win by one increment over the next highest bidder. If the next highest bid were $22.50, then you would win at $22.75. But
if some joker put in $900, like Steve said, you would end up paying the next increment, $910 at that level. NEVER bid an amount you are not ready to pay! Bid the absolute max you would be willing to pay to get that item!


Steve also said:

>>You're on target with your guess about the reason for sniping. It's NOT to get the last bid in; it's to avoid the nickel-and-dime-run-the-bid-up crap you see so many less sophisticated bidders engage in.<<

This is SOOOOOOO true. Most of the things on which I bid are worth very little "real" money; it is collectors, buffs and sentimentalists who have the interest. But not a week passes that I don't watch people determined to have the final say--to not let the other bidder(s) win "their" auction. They view the auction more like a card game, where each player ups the ante, seeking to make the others sweat it out or fold. As a result, they end up showing their hand: their interest and willingness to bid ever higher places the other bidders on notice. In contrast, the sniper has a poker face and does nothing until the end, at which time he most frequently is the one holding the best cards.

Jim, part of why AS works so well is the fact that so many eBayers, especially newbies, play these games of one-upmanship. In other words, they DON'T bid their true maximum amounts, and are willing to keep upping the bid higher and higher, which makes the item more expensive. But if there were no one else countering their bids with higher bids, they would leave their bids alone. The guy who might have repeatedly upped his bid to $100, leaves his $25 as is, until the sniper comes along and wins for $26. The losing bidder may sometimes whine that he did not "have a chance" to bid higher, but he DID have the same chance, and simply chose to play lowball bid.

You may ask, "Then why not simply bid on the auction manually, even days away, and place that $100 bid? If the other bidders are not willing to bid that high, you would still win." This is partially true. In some cases you would win, simply because you bid your max and no one else was willing to pay. But in others you would not win, because the same guy who would have nickel-and-dimed his bids up to $100 (bidding six times with some other bidder, during a war), may see your bid and answered with an even higher one. But if you don't give him the opportunity to do that, there is a probablity that his bid will stay at that $25 mark, because emotionally speaking, that's how things work.

ONLY bid what you are willing to pay! But with AS bidding for you--freeing you from having to sit by the computer--you WILL win MOST of the time, certainly far more than you ever did on your own! The only down side is the auctions you do lose, because someone else paid more. I say "the down side" because I find that I win 95% of my auctions with AS, and I am so accustomed to winning, that the rare loss stings even more! What a great way to end post #100!

Jim,

Steve and Chatter are giving you doctorate sniping advice here.

P. S. Especially Chatter's. Those kind of responses take a lot of time, and care.

And an excellent grasp of the science and psychology of sniping, too. Great stuff, Chatter! Congrats on Forum post #100.

Does this mean I have been conferred the D.S. degree by the two professors?

Chatter,

I'm one of your fans, but I can't be included in the same degree as Steve, or you. I'm an Associate; at best, a Bachelor. I don't have the patience of either of you two, as will be obvious with my next post. But, thank you for including me.

Oh...I don't know about that, Rick. I think you're easily post-graduate level. What say, Chatter? Do you agree?

And Jim;

I thought about responding to anyone of a number your posts where you provided various examples of auction prices; but to tell you the truth, I felt I would need a Cray computer to figure out all the various variables. Here's a recap of the prices you've included in your posts: 10 dollars, $200, $10, $20, $22, $20, $200, $20, $30, $30, $20.50, $10, $100, $110, $10.50, $11.00, $22.50, $1000, $1000, $22.50. I could do another one on the number of seconds you threw into the equations, but I hope you get the idea.

My point is this: Steve and Chatter were very gracious in their time. I wasn't, and very few have been. I hope you appreciate the amount of energy they spent on you. I DO!

Chatter, Steve, and Rick,

Thanks a bunch guys!!! I really appreciate
your responses. You've shed a lot of light
on the ebay sniping business for me. I am
determined to win this one bid because I want
it so bad! Now I know I can setup the snipe
and not worry about it.

So you guys usually win 95% of the time?
That's a high success rate!

Thanks.

Jim

Another tip, I almost always bid/snipe an uneven amount, e.g. £15.15. The number of times that extra 15p has won me an auction is unreal. Say both I and a fellow bidder/sniper believe an item is worth £15.00, my opponent has bid £15.00 but as he's current high bidder eBay is only showing that he's bid, say, £12.00; my bid of £15.15 comes a long a few seconds before the auction ends and EVEN THOUGH we both have the same nominal bid (e.g. £15.00) and even though he got there first and even though the bid increment from £15.00 is more than 15p - I still win in that situation. whoohoo!

Rick,

How long did it take you to type all those dollar signs?

No matter how many seconds before auction ending I snipe or how many seconds my opponents snipe at, it all depends on who has the highest bid eh?
Now how bout 2.5 seconds before auction ending... does that make a difference? Heh.

I'll let you guys know how the snipe turns out on Sunday noon time.

Jim

IanN, I bid in terms of bid increments...always one or two increments above what I think it would take to beat the current high bidder, up to the maximum I'm willing to spend. Your 15 pence might not be enough if the current high bid is £10.16. Remember, you don't know what the actual bid amount is, but to beat it you'll have to look at the amount of the pence as well as the amount of the pounds.

Jim, 2.5 seconds on a Sunday? You've got to pay better attention to what we've been saying, lad. You stand a better than even chance of your bid not being accepted in time by eBay. You might get away with it or you might not, but why take the chance? What were we just talking about? "It's not who gets in the LAST bid, it's who gets in the HIGHEST bid."

On Sundays, eBay's busiest day of the week, I allow at least 8 seconds during the morning hours, 15 seconds in the afternoon, and 30 seconds after 6 PM.

Ian beat me to the amount issue--I was waiting to bring that up in Jim's intermediate level course!

I never bid even amounts. I always bid off-the-wall dollar amounts, e.g., $11.09 or £12.77. (There, I finally got to use that pound symbol also!) Ian handily explained the reason why.

As for degree level, I know that I have been on AS (or at least its forum) a bit longer than Rick), but he has been a more active poster than I will probably ever be. I tend to leave the short and quick answers for Rick and Steve, whereas I like the more in-depth analysis scenarios better.

OK, how about we say that Steve, with the most advanced credentials in the field, is our dean; Rick is our department head, and I will take on the title of instructor professor. All positions carry a doctorate, but the dean and department head have the deepest field experience.

"How long did it take you to type all those dollar signs?" - Jim

A fair amount of time. I kept getting confused and losing my place, so I had to start over serveral times.


Chatter,

Sounds like a good solution.

If you're bidding what you're willing to pay - then the win percentage isn't that important. I'd say I win about 80% of my bids, which is much higher than without sniping - but I don't care about the ones I lose. Someone was willing to pay more than I was. Since I'm a collector in a very specialized area, I really know what the items are worth. BUT - often there are people that want to buy something for sentimental reasons - then what it is worth doesn't really matter.

AS lets you "set it and forget it" as Ron Popeil would say.

Guys,

Another quick question.

I have a snipe setup in my "My Snipes" folder.
If it shows Status: Read (with Ready in green letters).... that means this snipe is setup already and I don't have to do anything to it right? Just confirming.

Thanks!
Jim

quote:

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Originally posted by SniperJim:
Guys,

Another quick question.

I have a snipe setup in my "My Snipes" folder.
If it shows Status: Read (with Ready in green letters).... that means this snipe is setup already and I don't have to do anything to it right? Just confirming.

Thanks!
Jim

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Correct!

And Jim, if you haven't already done so, check out "Instamail".

I've read pros and cons about Instamail.

Comments?

quote:

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Originally posted by judyandstu:
I've read pros and cons about Instamail.

Comments?

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All it seems to to is rouse the misguided ire of some sellers. Others are indifferent about it. It may offer AS an advantage, but it does not offer me any.